Alberta government minister Tyler Shandro started Day 3 on the stand for his Law Society of Alberta (LSA) conduct hearing recounting an incident on a doctor’s driveway.
A number of delays and in-camera discussions extended the tribunal beyond the originally-scheduled three days.
On Wednesday, the justice minister recalled the circumstances and events around two of the three citations he’s facing from when he was the province’s health minister.
One citation comes from his access to and use of two doctors’ private cell phone numbers outside of regular business hours following a Feb. 26, 2020, press conference at the Red Deer Regional Hospital.
Another citation is about his email response to Janice Fraser, who he knew prior to becoming MLA of Calgary-Acadia. In that March 20, 2020, response, Shandro threatened to refer Fraser to “protective services” after she sent a message to his wife.
On Thursday, Shandro provided testimony to the final citation surrounding his visit to Dr. Mukarram Zaidi’s home on March 21, 2020, where he allegedly yelled at the doctor from the street.
He disputed the account Zaidi gave on Tuesday.
Shandro’s side of the story
“I know (Zaidi) to be a very vocal and passionate person. I do not believe that he would have tolerated anyone yelling at him.”
The then-health minister said he went to the doctor’s home because they were neighbours and had a multi-year history of sitting on the board of the Calgary-West Progressive Conservative constituency association, and he went there alone.
Zaidi’s testimony from Day 1 of the hearing stated that Shandro was emotional and visibly upset.
On Thursday, Shandro testified he was not in tears when Zaidi came out to greet him at the end of the driveway. Being early in the COVID-19 pandemic, Shandro said the two men kept their distance.
“Obviously I had emotions,” he said. “Most of the emotions were disappointment and sadness at what a friend had done.
“Definitely not crying at that time or at any time.”
Shandro said the interaction with the doctor came the day after another man allegedly visited his wife’s office, making threats of physical violence.
Police interviewed his wife at their home on Friday, March 20, 2020, after he returned from working in the Alberta legislature in Edmonton. Shandro said the possibility of threats coming to their home upset them and their sons.
That incident at Shandro’s wife’s workplace was preceded by an increasing number of threats and social media posts alleging conflicts of interest between Shandro as then-health minister and the family’s holdings in Vital Partners, a third-party health benefits brokerage led by Shandro’s wife.
Shandro said there was “such a volume” of threats that, instead of forwarding them to Neil Lettis, superintendent of the Alberta Sheriff’s Executive Protection Unit, he put his wife in direct contact with Lettis.
The next day, Shandro said he was watching television with his sons while his wife did some work elsewhere in the house.
She called him over to see a meme reposted by Zaidi of Shandro with a thought bubble containing the words “So every Albertan I can kick off health care is another client we can sign up to Vital Partners! We’re going to be rich!”
That’s when Shandro decided to leave his house.
“I thought, ‘It’s daylight. I’ll go see Mukarram (and) talk about this,’” Shandro testified, adding he was in “disbelief” an acquaintance would express the concerns the way he did.
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Shandro said he addressed the doctor by his first name, indicating they knew one another and were acquainted with each others’ families.
He then asked if he knew the allegations of conflict of interest were resulting in death threats.
On Tuesday, Zaidi said he was unaware of any threats or cyberbullying of Shandro’s wife when he posted the meme.
Shandro said he was “animated” in the manner one would while speaking with a friend who caused disappointment and frustration, and that his voice was loud enough to gap the social distancing but not so loud that neighbours could easily eavesdrop.
The minister said they talked about changes to billing codes for doctors and he characterized Zaidi’s behaviour and body language as “one of regret” after Shandro told him about the death threats.
On Tuesday, Zaidi faced multiple cross-examination questions, asking if he posted the meme to “embarass” the Shandros, which he denied.
Zaidi did say seeing Shandro in a “heightened” state at the end of his driveway “caught me by surprise.”
After the brief conversation about the codes, Shandro said Zaidi was “still looking down at the driveway, looking regretful and perhaps a little embarrassed, and he said softly ‘What do I do? Do I delete the post?’
“I specifically and explicitly did not take him up on that.”
Shandro said he reiterated his need for Zaidi to understand the threats being addressed to his wife.
The minister said his wife eventually joined him, appearing to have recently cried, but did not put her arms around him, as Zaidi had earlier testified.
Shandro said she did not address the doctor, but instead told her husband, “Don’t talk to him. He’s not interested in us. He’s only interested in money.”
Shandro said he later saw Zaidi removed his reposting of the meme and the doctor’s follow-up statement that while he may have disagreements with the health minister about primary care, he did “not support any threat against the Honorable Minister Tyler Shandro and his family. We support civilised discussion.”
LSA lawyer Ken McEwan revealed Zaidi had posted the same meme and message — “So Tyler Shandro your business (Vital Partners) seems in conflict with your position in government, what say you?” – to multiple Twitter accounts and hadn’t deleted them all — a point Zaidi raised to McEwan overnight.
Zaidi previously testified he was active on multiple social media accounts for various advocacy efforts, including primary health care and concerns for people of the Muslim faith.
Shandro said the two men did not communicate after that driveway confrontation, despite having each others’ phone numbers and email addresses.
Shandro said he learned of a possible story of the interaction in the media from MLA Mike Ellis, who Shandro had supported in a Calgary-West byelection and was an acquaintance of Zaidi as well.
The minister said he “had an indication” from Ellis that a news story was going to be published about the incident, and decided it wasn’t a good idea to follow up with the doctor.
When questioned why he gave around nine interviews with other media outlets, having previously stated he wanted to keep the matter private, Zaidi said the CBC broke the news on March 27, 2020, and the information was in the public domain.
“There was no point in shying back (once the information went public),” Zaidi said on Wednesday.
Shandro said he didn’t think there was anything wrong with the incident on the driveway. He also said he didn’t believe his conduct at the time had anything to do with being a lawyer or a member of the LSA.
Questioning Shandro
Shandro was called to the bar in 2005. He closed his practice shortly after being elected MLA for Calgary-Acadia but chose to keep his membership with the law society active.
“I take my duties to the law society very seriously,” Shandro said when asked about his initial response to the LSA’s citations.
In that early response, Shandro wrote that the Alberta Medical Association (AMA) had leaked the driveway confrontation to the media.
But under cross-examination by LSA counsel Ken McEwan, Shandro admitted he didn’t have explicit knowledge of who spoke with then-CBC reporter Charles Rusnell, who first broke the story, instead inferring he spoke with the AMA given their advocacy efforts.
“I don’t know who first spoke to Mr. Rusnell, no,” Shandro said.
Shandro also admitted to having other inaccuracies in an early reply to the LSA around his call with Dr. Lauralee Dukeshire, a doctor who attended the Red Deer Regional Hospital press conference.
Despite the maelstrom around a perceived conflict of interest, the justice minister was questioned if he took steps to further distance himself from the 50 per cent of voting shares in Vital Partners held in Shandro Holdings, a blind trust that lists his wife as trustee.
“I have not, no,” Shandro said.
Shandro noted the structure of the blind trust followed the advice of the ethics commissioner who, in March 2020, found him not to be in breach of conflict.
Doctor disagrees
Shandro’s cross examination was interrupted mid-afternoon when his lawyer Grant Stapon became aware of a tweet from Zaidi alleging Shandro “lied under oath.”
“When he came to my house he was crying, eyes were red, emotionally charged and yelling, his wife was holding him and accusing me,” Zaidi tweeted in the early afternoon, saying he was doing an interview with a member of the media.
When Zaidi returned to the hearing on Wednesday, he made it known that he was aware of social media posts surrounding the hearing, but the hearing chair admitted the doctor was not admonished to stay away from social media, as witnesses might during a criminal trial.
After a private meeting to discuss a remedy to the doctor’s social media post, hearing panel chair Bud Melnyk said Thursday they would allow Shandro to publicly reply to the allegations Zaidi made on social media without being in contempt of the hearing’s proceedings. But those replies could still be subject to questioning.
The hearing started the day in camera as well, apparently discussing an inappropriate disclosure of private information during Wednesday’s testimonies.
The conduct hearing was adjourned to a yet-to-be-announced date. Shandro’s cross-examination will continue at that point and his wife is expected to be called as a witness.
If the tribunal decides to sanction the justice minister, sanctions could range from fines and conditions for practice to suspension or, at the most extreme, disbarment.
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