The man who stabbed and beheaded a fellow Greyhound bus passenger four years ago is now breaking his silence.
In an interview with the chief executive officer of the Schizophrenia Society of Canada, Vince Li apologized for the incident. “I would ask forgiveness, but I know it would be hard to accept,” he said to Chris Summerville.
Li recalled the horrifying events of July, 2008 when he suddenly attacked Tim McLean, who was sleeping in the seat next to him on the Greyhound bus travelling eastbound on the TransCanada Highway near Portage La Prairie, Manitoba.
“I bought a knife at Canadian Tire. I bought it for any emergency for the journey to protect myself from the aliens. I was really scared. I remember cutting off his head. I believed he was an alien. The voices told me to kill him. That he would kill me or others. I do not believe this now. It was totally wrong. It was my fault. I sinned. But it was the schizophrenia,” Li says.
Summerville has been meeting with Li in the Selkirk Mental Health Centre once every two months since the killing.
Summerville says the interview was about 45 minutes long, and not recorded except on paper. Li has rejected several media requests for interviews because he does no want to be on camera. Summerville says he wrote out the questions in advance, and went slowly through the answers with Li, asking him occasionally to repeat portions as he wrote the answers down.
He released the interview with Li to media Tuesday to shed light on what Li has been going through. “I think the media has been more favourable to the McLean family, probably because public sentiment is on their side and we as a country have entered a period of ‘tough on crime’ with little attention paid to restorative justice, rehabilitation, recovery and redemption, or the influence and role of mental illness in this particular most unfortunate incident,” said Summerville.
Here is the edited version of the 45-minute interview between Li and Summerville:
Tell me about your background?
I am a 44 years old and grew up in northeastern China in the province of Liaoning. My mother and father are still living. I have an older brother who is a businessman and a younger sister who is a secretary. They know about the Greyhounds bus situation, but my mother and father do not.
My wife and I immigrated to Winnipeg, Canada in June, 2001. I had studied as a computer engineer for 4 years in China. But I could not find a job in Canada. I worked at McDonalds, Meatland Foods and at Grant Memorial Baptist Church.
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Do you have a spirituality?
I believe in Jesus Christ. He is my Saviour. I try to follow God.
When did you begin to experience schizophrenia?
In 2004. I didn’t know what it was. I now know what it is. I began to hear voices that normal people do not hear. I thought I heard the voice of God telling me to write down my journey. The voice told me that I was the third story of the Bible. That I was like the second coming of Jesus. I was to save people from a space alien attack. That is why I traveled around the country. I am not sure of all the places I went to. I now know that it was schizophrenia I was suffering from.
Why did you do what you did on the bus?
I bought a knife at Canadian Tire. I bought it for any emergency for the journey to protect myself from the aliens. I was really scared. I remember cutting off his head. I believed he was an alien. The voices told me to kill him. That he would kill me or others. I do not believe this now. It was totally wrong. It was my fault. I sinned. But it was the schizophrenia.
What else do you remember about the incident?
I try to forget it. I try to stay busy here. It is painful to think about.
How do you fell about what happened?
I feel nervous. I feel painful. I am embarrassed. It was wrong.
Do you understand why people are scared of you?
Yes. I don’t think I will ever do it again. I didn’t know at that time I had schizophrenia. Now I do.
What would you say to Ms. de Delly and Tim Mc Lean’s family?
I am really sorry for what I did. If I could talk to her directly I would do anything for their family. I would ask forgiveness, but I know it would be hard to accept.
How has the time been at Selkirk Mental Health Centre?
I know that I suffer from schizophrenia. The treatment team gives me a chance to recover, to be normal. I am glad to be taking the medication.
Do you think you are getting better?
Yes. My thinking is becoming normal. I don’t think weird things. I take my medication, Olanzapine, everyday. I am glad to take it. I don’t have any weird voices any more.
How do we know you will take your medication when you get out on your own?
I would be glad to be under a treatment order because medication helps me. It is very important. I don’t want to do what I did ever again.
How does it make you feel that most people do not think you should get a pass to walk around in Selkirk? Do you understand their fear?
I understand people are scared because of my behaviour on the Greyhound bus. I am not at risk for anybody. I don’t believe in aliens. I don’t hear voices. I would call my doctor if I heard voices again. Yes, I understand their fear.
Some say the RCMP should have killed you that night?
I should have been killed at that time. I still believe that. But I am thankful that the RCMP didn’t.
What is schizophrenia? What are you learning?
It is hearing voices or having delusions. You don’t know what is real. I need to take medication on time. I also have to have meaningful activity, something to do. I have to learn how to handle stress.
What helps you deal with stress?
Taking my medication. Exercising and doing Bible study with the chaplain here.
Do you have side-effects from the medication?
Yes. I sleep too much. I feel tired a lot and I have gained some weight.
Do you believe you should be under a treatment order?
I should be here. I should be under a treatment order.
If you ever got out of Selkirk Mental Health Centre, what would you do?
I hope to leave one day, but I have to make sure it wouldn’t happen again. That there would be no voices. I would change my name to be anonymous. But I would still be in touch with my doctor.
What do you think of Tim’s Law that any “mentally insane person who kills someone would never be released.” ?
I don’t think so, that that should happen. Mental illness is an illness. It is treatable. My schizophrenia is not the real me, but it is an illness.
How would you know you were getting sick again?
Hearing voices, stopping my medication, and starting to believe in aliens. God would not tell me to do something bad.
How do you feel about what you are reading in the newspapers?
I don’t read the papers because I don’t want to be reminded of what happened on the Greyhound bus because it was so bad and wrong.
Are you happy?
No.
Will you ever be happy?
No. I can never forget the Greyhound bus.
Any final words?
I would like to say to Tim McLean’s mother I am sorry for killing your son. I am sorry for the pain I have caused. I wished I could reduce that pain.
As we ended the interview I could see the moisture in Mr. Li’s eyes. It is remarkable the insight Mr. Li has. It is even more remarkable the positive effects of the medication. Up to 25 percent of people who will have a psychotic break with reality will never experience another psychotic episode. Up to 65 per cent will experience a degree of recovery in order to live a meaning life. Ten per cent will take their life by suicide due to the losses associated with schizophrenia. Of the 300,000 people in Canada who live with some form of schizophrenia, the vast majority lead quiet, law abiding lives hoping for some quality of life. People living with schizophrenia are more likely to be victims of violence rather than being perpetrators of violence. Schizophrenia is treatable. Recovery is possible.
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